What years will Harley sidecar fit?
BLUEBIKE
Posted 4/7/2007 8:39 AM (#24338)
Subject: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


OK nothing new about this .I ask 3 Harley dealers got 3 different answers.I'm sure that someone here will know this.I have a harley Sidecar that came off of a 1997 FLHTC and want to know if it will fit a 2007 FLHTCU.You would think you could go to the dear and get a streight answer to a question.

Thanks
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Hack'n
Posted 4/7/2007 11:37 AM (#24341 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
There were frame changes on the bike between the two years due to engine and drive changes from the old Evo 5 speed to the present configuration.
The car itself will fit but there may be newer mountings involved. Also there were changes in the brakes, wiring and electronics between the two.
I've read in the Forums here that there are Sidecar Service Manuals available from the Motor Company. Perhaps these would help.
I've had more luck with the Factory's Customer Relations people than with dealers. They've chased down some pretty obscure information for me.

Lonnie
Northwest Sidecar
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BLUEBIKE
Posted 4/7/2007 12:57 PM (#24342 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


Lonnie thanks I was pretty sure either you or Jay would answer this.The electrical is not a big concern I'll be able to figure that part out.The main concern was mounting hardware.I guess I'll buy it and hope it will work out if not you'll be seeing it for sale here.

Thanks John
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gnm109
Posted 4/9/2007 7:37 PM (#24414 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Hi,

I took a look in my 2006 sidecar book and it does not show an exact cross-reference to a particular conneection kit. For a 2006 motorcycle, they show 1999 to 2006 sidecars. The latest bike they show connecting to a 1989-1997 sidecar is a 1999 to 2002.

Nonetheless, the latest sidecar connection kit part number that I have is 87166-998. I presume that you would be lookiing for an 87166-99C for your machine, assuming that the 2007 frame is different.

You will also be needing a bank angle conversion kit - 87115-03 to convert your modern bank angle sensor to a rollover kit.

The dealer, if they have the latest sidecar service book (99485-07) should be able to advise you as to the proper connection kit.

It is possible, if you got the mounts with the sidecar, that you really only need the rear mount to match the 2007 frame as I do not believe that any changes were made to the upper front and lower front mounts. Possibly the rear is different and the parts book for the 2007 touring bikes (which also contains all of the sidecar part numbers) will show the proper part number for the rear mount. Then, the rest of the connection process would be straightforward, just connecting the sidecar cable to your bike. It might take an adapter or two for the connectors but it's not really all that difficult.

The electrical connections to the standard TLE sidecar contain only the front fender tip light, brake and tail lights and the turn signal. The right turn signal bulb on your bike is removed and the sidecar turn signal only is used to prevent confusion.

The Ultra sidecar has a more complex conection to the Ultra motorcycle due to the radio conncetions. Figuring that out, if you do indeed have an Ultra sidecar (with radio amplifier) would take some thought and doing.

Be prepared for sticker shock if you have to buy the entire connection kit. The rear mount wouldn't be all that bad, though.

Good luck!



Edited by gnm109 4/9/2007 7:39 PM
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timo482
Posted 4/11/2007 11:38 AM (#24471 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


Posts: 630
Location: Belle Plaine MN
definitively - straight answer

to put a TLE or TLE Ultra on a 2007 bike you need 2007 front lower mounts, 2007 brake master cyl kit, 2007 rear mount. it was cheaper by 300 to buy the whole kit for 1,100$ so i did.

if you have a TLE ULtra you need to get a complete wire kit for the sidecar for 2006 & 2007 sidecars - there is not ONE part of the ultra harness from a pre 2006 ultra sidecar that will fit on a 2007 bike. [well the tail light wire works] i got that kit works perfect - BIG BUX.

99 to 2006 use the same mounting kit, 98 to 2005 have the same wire, 2006 sidecars use the old mount with the new wire, 2007 use the new wire and new mounts

there is NO WAY to use the old mounts on a 2007 - been there, tried that, no hope at all.

that said - the thing is really wonderfull - i put in a liberty tree and it handles really nice & the 96 makes it almost scary fast - i can set the cruise control on 85 and it just goes... if you do it - get the dual bulb headlight - even the non HID one - its really worth it at speed at night.

if i knew when i traded in my 2000 bike with the 2004 tle what i know now - i would have saved about 450$ to have traded in the pair & purchased a matched pair - the modification parts for my 2004 cost that much. live and learn.

the reason you get garbage answers is the definitive answer is only in the SIDE CAR SERVICE MANUAL for the particular year bike. the 2007 manual was just released about the first week in march. & most dealers dont have one - basically only users get them - the service techs also have access to the contents on there computer screens.
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gnm109
Posted 4/11/2007 12:10 PM (#24473 - in reply to #24471)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by timo482 on 4/11/2007 8:38 AM

definitively - straight answer

to put a TLE or TLE Ultra on a 2007 bike you need 2007 front lower mounts, 2007 brake master cyl kit, 2007 rear mount. it was cheaper by 300 to buy the whole kit for 1,100$ so i did.

if you have a TLE ULtra you need to get a complete wire kit for the sidecar for 2006 & 2007 sidecars - there is not ONE part of the ultra harness from a pre 2006 ultra sidecar that will fit on a 2007 bike. [well the tail light wire works] i got that kit works perfect - BIG BUX.

99 to 2006 use the same mounting kit, 98 to 2005 have the same wire, 2006 sidecars use the old mount with the new wire, 2007 use the new wire and new mounts

there is NO WAY to use the old mounts on a 2007 - been there, tried that, no hope at all.

that said - the thing is really wonderfull - i put in a liberty tree and it handles really nice & the 96 makes it almost scary fast - i can set the cruise control on 85 and it just goes... if you do it - get the dual bulb headlight - even the non HID one - its really worth it at speed at night.

if i knew when i traded in my 2000 bike with the 2004 tle what i know now - i would have saved about 450$ to have traded in the pair & purchased a matched pair - the modification parts for my 2004 cost that much. live and learn.

the reason you get garbage answers is the definitive answer is only in the SIDE CAR SERVICE MANUAL for the particular year bike. the 2007 manual was just released about the first week in march. & most dealers dont have one - basically only users get them - the service techs also have access to the contents on there computer screens.


Good update! All true!

Yeah, they keep changing and changing. I myself have the 88" engine but I've already got a pair of cylinders to bore to 95" for a nice winter job. There's a few more HP. in there!

You're right about maybe getting the whole darn rig complete rather than haveing to mix and match parts. In my case, I went for the TLE sidecar since I didn't want the radio amplifier and I also think that the Ultra radio pod takes up too much room in any case. I just ran the passenger headset connection cable over to the sidecar with mounts on the front saddlebar rail. My S.O. can plug in there for intercomm and listening in. She also has a P.T.T. button on the right side of the Tourpak seat and a volume control.

I ordered my sidecar by VIN for a 2004 bike. The configuration I got is 2004-2005 Vivid Black colors with silver stripes. The paint match is perfect. It's got a 2005 owner's manual and it documented as a 2007 sidecar on the Bill of Sale.

Since I ordered it to match, there were no problem issues of mounts to fool with and I already had the Sidecar Service Manual from my salesman, bless his heart, he gave me one when I put in the order. The unit came with everything needed and I'm very pleased.


Happy Trails!



Edited by gnm109 4/11/2007 12:11 PM
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BLUEBIKE
Posted 4/16/2007 11:58 AM (#24599 - in reply to #24473)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


Thanks seems like a good answer I don't mind buying the mounting kit.I was looking at the 2007 to the 1997 and I see that the frame of the 07 has a disc brake and the other thing I see is that the 07 has a part called a stand off in parts list that the 1997 doesn't have on the front lower mount and in the illistration it looks like the1997 has a sharper bend in the lower front mount section but that could just be the way it was drawn.
Thanks John
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gnm109
Posted 4/16/2007 1:07 PM (#24603 - in reply to #24599)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by BLUEBIKE on 4/16/2007 8:58 AM

Thanks seems like a good answer I don't mind buying the mounting kit.I was looking at the 2007 to the 1997 and I see that the frame of the 07 has a disc brake and the other thing I see is that the 07 has a part called a stand off in parts list that the 1997 doesn't have on the front lower mount and in the illistration it looks like the1997 has a sharper bend in the lower front mount section but that could just be the way it was drawn.
Thanks John



The later sidecars (1997 on) are fitted with a re-designed bent-tubing style loop frame. It's a couple of inches lower than the earlier TLE/TLE Ultra frames. It also has the disc brake and single leaf springs in order to lower the tub another two inches on the frame. This results in a noticeably lower appearance and also better handling.

There are two re-designed stand-offs on the later frames. They are P/N 87159-02 (rear) and P/N 87615-02 (front, zinc-colored)

In 2002 HD went to easily adjustable mounts. That means that the two stand-offs are left handed threads and the Heim joint which connects to the mount on the bike is right handed. So, to bring about an adjustment, you need only loosen the two jam nuts and then you can turn the stand-off in or out to change toe-in without removing the Heim joint. This is a BIG advantage since removing the joints on the earlier models was a big deal and definitely required help.

Typically, the only adjustments needed after installation are lean and toe-in. The lean is easily accomplished by loosening the front bow (four bolts) and moving the bike one way or another. I have a magnetic protractor that I put on the frame to tell the angle.

The toe-in is accomplished as mentioned above.

So in order to get that feature, you would need a 2002 or later TLE or TLE Ultra since the frame threads are left-handed after 2002, at least going by the part number.

Good luck.

P.S. Sure hope no one bashes me for talking about a HD sidecar on this forum. LOL


Edited by gnm109 4/16/2007 1:08 PM
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Hack'n
Posted 4/16/2007 1:37 PM (#24606 - in reply to #24603)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
P.S. Sure hope no one bashes me for talking about a HD sidecar on this forum. LOL

It's good to see some definitive answers to H-D sidecar mount questions.
The dealers aren't much help as most of their "PHD tech's" have a very limited exposure to any sidecar knowledge. Sidecars are just not high priority in the overall sales picture.
And they take up too much valuable "Lifestyle" space in the new H-D (New School) Boutiques.

Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars
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gnm109
Posted 4/16/2007 5:34 PM (#24616 - in reply to #24606)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by Hack'n on 4/16/2007 10:37 AM

P.S. Sure hope no one bashes me for talking about a HD sidecar on this forum. LOL

It's good to see some definitive answers to H-D sidecar mount questions.
The dealers aren't much help as most of their "PHD tech's" have a very limited exposure to any sidecar knowledge. Sidecars are just not high priority in the overall sales picture.
And they take up too much valuable "Lifestyle" space in the new H-D (New School) Boutiques.

Lonnie
Northwest Sidecars


I agree completely that the HD folks are not properly trained with regard to sidecars. To the credit of the folks with whom I dealt at the dealer near me, they bent over backwards to find out the information. When I was getting ready to make my order last October, I would ask questions and within a day or two I got a call from the sales person with the correct answer. Really, what he lacked in knowledge, he made up for with enthusiasm. He really made it fun!

What neither of us knew was whether all of the necessary equipment was available WITHIN the sidecar crate as it was delivered. In fact, it was and I discovered (empirically, LOL) that Harley supplies every last single nut, bolt and roll pin for installation. The color is matched perfectly, all mounts are there, any electronic cables or modules needed are provided as well as complete installation instructions.

As you correctly point out, it's not a high priority for Harley. Unfortunately, as I have discovered, sidecars are like a fine wine in a beer-drinking society. Everybody knows that they are there but not everybody wants one. Accordingly, Harley keeps then around for the people who are sophisticated enough to want one and they provide them but they don't spend any time at all advertising them or training their people. Also, as you say, they don't like to put them on the floor, unless they are spoken for. It's very seldom you will find a new rig at a dealer that has not already been sold. They do take up precious floor space.







Edited by gnm109 4/18/2007 1:57 PM
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chesapeake
Posted 5/5/2007 5:42 PM (#25146 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


that being said, and I have read all the threads I should have no connection issues with installing a 2001 sidecar (HD) to a 2005 Ultra classic,, my sidecar has no radio I guess its the basic unit? please confirm, Thanks
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gnm109
Posted 5/5/2007 7:48 PM (#25149 - in reply to #25146)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by chesapeake on 5/5/2007 2:42 PM

that being said, and I have read all the threads I should have no connection issues with installing a 2001 sidecar (HD) to a 2005 Ultra classic,, my sidecar has no radio I guess its the basic unit? please confirm, Thanks


Hi,

If you have the standard TLE sidecar (no radio, no handholds, seat top level with sidecar tub) then you treat the installation as if you did not have an Ultra motorcycle. That's what I did....I have the 2004 TLE standard configuration sidecar with a 2004 Ultra but no radio in the tub.

Therefore, according to my book, P/N 99485-06, the 2005 motorcycle fits up to a 1999-2005 sidecar with the following parts needed:

1. P/N 87166-99B Connection kit for 1999-2005 motorcycles. Note, at some point in the 1990's Harley changed to a two bolt lower rear mount. I presume that the proper two-bolt mount (P/N 87114-93A) would be included with the -99B connection kit.
2. P/N 87776-98 Brake line - Note, this will be on the sidecar.
3. P/N 70221-99 Light harness - Note, this will be on the sidecar. It powers the sidecar fender front marker light and stop/tail and turn from the sidecar. It connects into the brake light cable under the seat on the motorcycle at a connector just behind the battery.
4. P/N 88115-03, Bank angle sensor switch kit. These list at $128.95. You will need one to change the bank angle function to a roll-over function. You could possibly skip this but you run the risk of having an engine shutdown on a hard turn. Your call. After 2003, this has to be programmed by the dealer using the Digital Technician diagnostic tool to set it to "sidecar"..
5. P/N 87165-02. Standoff-front. It's not clear whether you would need to buy this since I don't know what is already on your sidecar. This is a zinc-colored threaded coupler that fits into the front lower tube of the sidecar. I'm guessing that your sidecar already has the earlier one so you might be able to get by without this. Since it has a separate part number, I doubt that it would be included in the -99B connection kit if you are forced to buy one. (gulp, cough.

If you get a set of mounts with the sidecar, you will save lots of dough....maybe only have to buy the rear mount and the bank angle rollover kit.....cross your fingers.

If you think this stuff is confusing, it is. The problem gets worse when the bike and sidecar are more than 3 years apart in configuration.

The 2007 bikes are also totally different from our 2004/2005 configuration. LOL.

Hope this helps. Happy Trails!

P.S. By all means, get the Harley sidecar manual for your year........




Edited by gnm109 5/5/2007 10:41 PM
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chesapeake
Posted 5/5/2007 8:23 PM (#25150 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


Thank you should the manual be for the year of the tub or the bike?
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gnm109
Posted 5/5/2007 9:01 PM (#25152 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
I would get the 2005 book for your bike. The 2006 is just about the same and the 2007 is different. The bike is more inportant than the sidecar in this regard.

So look for a 99485-05 or -06. They are on eBay from time to time. Unfortunately, they are rather expensive at $58.00 list. They are available from online companies like Zanotti's and Chicago HD at a discount.

If you read the book, you will soon know as much if not more than the dealers. Ha.

gnm109



Edited by gnm109 5/6/2007 10:52 PM
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ChopperDoug
Posted 8/1/2007 12:31 AM (#27940 - in reply to #25149)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


Originally written by gnm109 on 5/5/2007 4:48 PM
If you think this stuff is confusing, it is. The problem gets worse when the bike and sidecar are more than 3 years apart in configuration.


Hello everybody. Let me introduce myself, my name is Doug. I just bought a used Harley TLE ultra ( I believe it's a 2004, but not possitive.) And I want to hook it up to my 1998 FLHT. I don't have all the mounts yet. But I wanted to find out if this set up will work. I couldn't get much information at the dealership, so I went online and found this site.

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gnm109
Posted 8/1/2007 11:04 AM (#27953 - in reply to #27940)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by ChopperDoug on 8/1/2007 2:29 AM

Originally written by gnm109 on 5/5/2007 4:48 PM
If you think this stuff is confusing, it is. The problem gets worse when the bike and sidecar are more than 3 years apart in configuration.


Hello everybody. Let me introduce myself, my name is Doug. I just bought a used Harley TLE ultra ( I believe it's a 2004, but not possitive.) And I want to hook it up to my 1998 FLHT. I don't have all the mounts yet. But I wanted to find out if this set up will work. I couldn't get much information at the dealership, so I went online and found this site.




Hi, Lots of what has been said in this thread so far will help you. As to the 2004 TLE with a 1998 bike, it should be OK with the following provisos:

You will need whichever rear mount fits your frame. I believe it would be a three bolt pattern. Harley has them or eBay. If you got the one that came with the 2004 bike, it would be a two bolt and you need a three bolt IIRC. I think they may have changed in 1999 but I'm not exactly sure. The dealer can help you there depending upon the configuraton of your frame.

The other two mounts and the steering damper will fit so long as you have all of the parts. You say you don't have all of the mounts yet.....I sure hope you don't have to buy them new. They are extremely expensive.

The 2004 connectors on the stoplight/taillight/fenderlight/brakelight cable from the sidecar may not match your bike's tail light cable connectors under the seat. If not, you need to buy the two matching connectors to make your cable match the bike. The dealer will order them for you.

The brake line will fit with no modification.

Good luck!


Edited by gnm109 8/1/2007 11:07 AM
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ChopperDoug
Posted 8/1/2007 10:08 PM (#27967 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


The guy I bought it off of still has the lower mount attached to his bike. He needs to pull the exhaust to get to the bolts. He got it used and only had it on his bike for a month, then changed his mind that he didn't want it anymore. I always liked the look of a sidecar, and couldn't pass up this chance to get one. The person he bought it off of didn't take care of how he removed the sidecar from the bike. The mounts are good, but the brake line and wires were just cut off. I already ordered a new wire harness and brake line. So I'm not going to ride it untill everything is working right. In the mean time I'll poke around this site and find out as much information that I can.
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gnm109
Posted 8/2/2007 10:58 AM (#27982 - in reply to #27967)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by ChopperDoug on 8/1/2007 7:08 PM

The guy I bought it off of still has the lower mount attached to his bike. He needs to pull the exhaust to get to the bolts. He got it used and only had it on his bike for a month, then changed his mind that he didn't want it anymore. I always liked the look of a sidecar, and couldn't pass up this chance to get one. The person he bought it off of didn't take care of how he removed the sidecar from the bike. The mounts are good, but the brake line and wires were just cut off. I already ordered a new wire harness and brake line. So I'm not going to ride it untill everything is working right. In the mean time I'll poke around this site and find out as much information that I can.


Well, I wonder if the rear brake is working on his motorcycle. Was his first name, Atilla? Just kidding. Hope you can get it together. I suggest that you purchase the sidecar manual from HD for your year of motorcycle.




Edited by gnm109 8/2/2007 10:59 AM
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ChopperDoug
Posted 8/5/2007 3:58 PM (#28120 - in reply to #24338)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?


The guy I bought it from never hooked up the brakes or lights. He just had it bolted up. Maybe that's why he didn't like it, and put it up for sale.

Hopefully my new brake line and wire harness will show up in the next few days. I've been wanting to take the rig out for a ride soooo bad, but it ain't leaving the garage untill everything is working right.

I have the service manual for my year bike (1998), use it eveytime I work on the bike. It has a wiring diagram for the same year TLE sidecar, and the 2004 sidecar that I have looks to be wired the same. I'm not worried about the radio, since most of the time I'll be riding solo or have the dog in the tub.
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gnm109
Posted 8/5/2007 5:15 PM (#28130 - in reply to #28120)
Subject: RE: What years will Harley sidecar fit?



Posts: 1370
Location: Sacramento County, California
Originally written by ChopperDoug on 8/5/2007 12:58 PM

The guy I bought it from never hooked up the brakes or lights. He just had it bolted up. Maybe that's why he didn't like it, and put it up for sale.

Hopefully my new brake line and wire harness will show up in the next few days. I've been wanting to take the rig out for a ride soooo bad, but it ain't leaving the garage untill everything is working right.

I have the service manual for my year bike (1998), use it eveytime I work on the bike. It has a wiring diagram for the same year TLE sidecar, and the 2004 sidecar that I have looks to be wired the same. I'm not worried about the radio, since most of the time I'll be riding solo or have the dog in the tub.


You should be in good shape when you gt your parts. Good luck!
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