mileage/speed
denim
Posted 3/12/2011 10:26 AM (#56589)
Subject: mileage/speed



Posts: 57
Location: Huntsville, Texas
i drive a 650 Yamaha (V-Star,) and a small sidecar. my mileage went from 48 to 35, and my top speed from 85+ to 70 or so. ( still lets me cruise at 60-65.) i am not assuming either to be a problem, just wondering if it is what i should have expected, and maybe ideas to help with the mileage.
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Hack'n
Posted 3/12/2011 10:54 AM (#56591 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
You've added a lot of weight rolling and wind resistance to a small displacement, relatively heavy. 650cc bike.
Add the driver and the mileage/Cruising speed are about what should be expected.

Lonnie
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denim
Posted 3/12/2011 12:52 PM (#56596 - in reply to #56591)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 57
Location: Huntsville, Texas
thanks; i needed the reassurance that i didn't mess up something. the only time the speed might be an issue would be riding with a group that wanted to go faster. and with the mileage i still have a range of a bit over a hundred miles. thank you for the reply.
jeri
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RogerE
Posted 3/12/2011 6:34 PM (#56599 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: RE: mileage/speed



Posts: 61
Location: Venice, Florida
one-night - 3/12/2011 10:26 AM

i drive a 650 Yamaha (V-Star,) and a small sidecar. my mileage went from 48 to 35, and my top speed from 85+ to 70 or so. ( still lets me cruise at 60-65.) i am not assuming either to be a problem, just wondering if it is what i should have expected, and maybe ideas to help with the mileage.


I have a Kawasaki Nomad 1700 with a Hannigan Astro GT sidecar. My mileage went from 36-37 to 30-31 when I added the sidecar. The bike will still go faster than I care to ride it)

I used to own a Yamaha 650 Classic, and it is on the small side for a sidecar rig. I am sure that motor is working hard. Is the bike stock? If not, you might consider exhaust and carb modifications for more power. I had pipes and rejetted carbs on mine - mileage dropped 20% (50 to 40) but the bike made a lot more power.
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SwampFox
Posted 3/12/2011 8:17 PM (#56601 - in reply to #56596)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 1660
Location: Summer Grove, LA USA
one-night - 3/12/2011 12:52 PM

... the only time the speed might be an issue would be riding with a group that wanted to go faster.... I still have a range of a bit over a hundred miles....
jeri


Hi Jeri: Our experience has been about 20-24% lower MPG and top speed. Top speed seems to be primarily limited by the increased wind drag. Also, a headwind will play havoc to MPG as well.

Also, be very careful riding with a group that wants to go faster. That can be a very dangerous situation for us sidecar folks.

Hey, are you aware Marcus is having sidecar training class this coming weekend up in Lufkin? Please consider participating. Before the training, I wasn't really driving/controlling the rig, more like herding it down the road. Jena & I both recommend it. We may be at this class too.

Contact Marcus at: marcuscycleshop@aol.com. Let me know if you need his phone number.
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Peter Pan
Posted 3/12/2011 8:49 PM (#56603 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 1914
Location: San Isidro de Heredia, Costa Rica
If I compare my consume with the Jawa with and without the sidecar and compare it with your consume
The difference comes out in the same range as yours. 3.3 l/100km solo and 4.2-4.35 l/100km = + 27 to 32%
With 48 to 35mpg you are at +37% that sounds reasonable to me.

Remember a rig has the aerodynamic of a parachute!!!!
Have fun and roll on.
Sven
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denim
Posted 3/14/2011 7:56 PM (#56655 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: RE: mileage/speed



Posts: 57
Location: Huntsville, Texas
thanks, i appreciate the in-put guys. i found an exhaust system that still has the cross-over pipe and most of the baffle; it is much more comfortable at 65mph with less exhaust noise! still doesn't seem to want to go much faster and that's okay.
i do plan to take the safety course when i can, and to continue to be careful till (and after) then.
also i am trying to get a phote small enough to load here.
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Phelonius
Posted 3/14/2011 11:54 PM (#56662 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: RE: mileage/speed



Posts: 725
Location: N.lat 20- 13' -58" W.lon 155 - 48' - 31"
one-night - 3/12/2011 7:26 AM

i drive a 650 Yamaha (V-Star,) and a small sidecar. my mileage went from 48 to 35, and my top speed from 85+ to 70 or so. ( still lets me cruise at 60-65.) i am not assuming either to be a problem, just wondering if it is what i should have expected, and maybe ideas to help with the mileage.


I did a 650 single cylinder Suzuki S-40 with a Velorex. Used it for 36 thousand miles before selling it.
Milage went from 55 MPG to 45 MPG. Top speed went from I don't know to low seventies.
Cruise all day at 60 to 65. Darkside Michlin 135 X 80 X 15"on the rear. Avon sidecar special 19" 0n the front.
hack wheel was 18"





Your Yamaha 650 is a heavier bike and shaft drive so you will get less milage.

Phelonius
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Hack'n
Posted 3/15/2011 1:42 PM (#56670 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
Jim,
Your pictured hack wheel looks strangely like a 3.50 x 16" Mitas shod OEM one.

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Phelonius
Posted 3/18/2011 12:51 AM (#56722 - in reply to #56670)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 725
Location: N.lat 20- 13' -58" W.lon 155 - 48' - 31"
My mistake, you are correct. After owning 10 sidecar rigs in my life it is getting difficult to remember all the details.
I sold that rig last spring.
I did change the bearings in that wheel to accept 18mm axle. I made the axle on my lathe and milled the sidecar fittings to match.
The original 15mm axle always seemed a bit wimpy to me.
I changed the belt drive to chain and sprocket running 15 X 50

I expect that the lighter weight gave me better milage than the Yamaha classic 650, also he is stuck with no options to change rear end ratios.

Phelonius

Edited by Phelonius 3/18/2011 1:01 AM
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denim
Posted 3/19/2011 9:37 AM (#56736 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 57
Location: Huntsville, Texas
i like the seat; i put one of those on a goldwing once, i had to take a hammer to the gas tank to make it fit. it wasn't an issue with the tank being hidden under the seat. a windshield from the same era gave me the look i was going for. cruising 60-65 is not a problem, i am actually driving about the same speed as before. yes the mileage was not so good to start with and i lost a little more than the 10mph that you did, going from 48 to 35.
i do have a question about something i ran across in another thread once; tire pressure in hack tire. what was the advantage in running lower pressure! the only thing i can think of is the bounce.
ms. jerilyn collins
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Hack'n
Posted 3/19/2011 12:54 PM (#56738 - in reply to #56736)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
Yeah, the seat is the first thing to go if one wants a comfortable ride on a LS650.
Too much hack tire pressure gives you excessive bounce and wears out the middle only of the hack tire due to the narrow footprint.

Edited by Hack'n 3/19/2011 1:00 PM
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denim
Posted 3/19/2011 1:13 PM (#56739 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 57
Location: Huntsville, Texas
thanks. yesterday i made a right turn from a stop, hit a bump with the hack tire, and as i continued into the turn the car lifted. i wasn't going fast so i just leaned my body to the right and it ws fine. maybe with a softer tire (less pressure,) it wouldn't have bounced so high.
the writing on the tire recommends 40#, but maybe half that much is enough? when i'm empty the sidecar weighs about 155# (30# steel plate mounted under frame for ballast,) but my passenger is another 190#, so i hope 20# air in tire would still be enough.
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Hack'n
Posted 3/19/2011 2:46 PM (#56740 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
Hanging off is best effected before the turn. The sudden shift of weight in the turn can cause the car to lift even more.
Hal Kendall describes a good way to tell if your sidecar is adequately weighted (right sidecar mounted).
Stand on the left footpeg (floorboard) with the bars turned to the right. Grasp both bars and pull away from the bike sharply.
If the car lifts easily you need more ballast weight unless you are an experienced (Extreme) hacker.

Lonnie
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82gl1100iwingman
Posted 7/12/2011 9:02 PM (#59008 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed


Got a question about checking to see if you need ballast. I have a 86 Goldwing Aspencade with a Champion Escort II sidecar. Probably a combined weight of 1000-1100 lbs (bike weighs 780 dry with no accessories but as Goldwing owner, I have probably close to 150 lbs of accessories). IF just standing on the left peg, wheel turned right, I can not just pick up the side car. But if I jump down hard and jerk on the handle bars I can pick it up 4". But again as quickly as it comes up, it goes hard right back down.
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Hack'n
Posted 7/12/2011 9:09 PM (#59010 - in reply to #56589)
Subject: Re: mileage/speed



Posts: 4833
Location: Boise, Idaho
Sounds like you have a well balanced rig.

Lonnie
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